EP 32 - GINA CONLEY
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KAREN: Welcome back to the show, Mamas. Today I have the pleasure of interviewing Gina Conley. She is the founder of Mama Stay Fit. You may know her on Instagram at Mama Stay Fit, and she is a perinatal fitness trainer and offers in person and online pre and post natal fitness training programs.
And I just love the content you put out, Gina. It is just always funny and informative and educational. And we're going to get all into how you can use prenatal training and fitness and biomechanics to have a pain free pregnancy and a smooth labor and delivery. So I'm so excited to have you on.
We haven't talked about this, this subject yet. So I'm sure we're going to dig into it, but welcome to the show.
GINA: Thank you for having me. I'm really excited to be here.
KAREN: Yay. So how did you get into prenatal fitness and training?
GINA: So I started training folks within like the pregnancy postpartum timeframe after the birth of my daughter.
So I have, this is, I'm pregnant right now with baby number four. So after the birth of my first child in 2017, I had transitioned off of active duty in the army and was trying to figure out. What I was going to do when I grew up and I kind of like stumbled upon this idea of I'm going to train people during their pregnancies and their postpartum because I didn't know what to do during my pregnancy.
There's so many lists of things to not do. Like don't do this. Don't do that. Like don't exercise on your back. Like, and there's so much caution and fear involved with exercising throughout pregnancy that I was also very fearful throughout my own pregnancy. And so when it came to postpartum, I was like, okay, well, are my organs falling out?
Like, what is this diastasis thing? And so trying to figure out, well, how do I even return to fitness after birth? And at that time in like 2017, there wasn't as many resources as there are now. I like now I'm like, there's so many different like perinatal fitness trainers out there online. We're like, it's much easier to find a program to help kind of guide you throughout your pregnancy and to help guide you in the postpartum, but that didn't exist back then, which is only seven years ago.
Like it feels like it wasn't that long. And so I went back to school, I got my master's in exercise science and I just started coaching people during this timeframe, figuring out what movements made sense. Which ones were helping them feel more comfortable in their pregnancies, which ones were helping them get back to their sport in the postpartum.
And then after about a year of that, I became a birth doula. And then I started to notice movement trends during labor. And so now I had this like in person experience from pregnancy, watching people during their livers and then in the postpartum to really understand how impactful movement could be with supporting like a strong and pain free pregnancy, helping someone prepare for birth because prenatal fitness needs to be more than just a list of pregnancy safe exercises.
Like it can't just be like a general fitness program that has no sit ups and jumping within it. Like we can use our fitness to help create more space within the pelvis to make it easier for our baby to navigate through to support our baby's position. And then also help us prepare like for the postpartum as well.
And so our biggest focus is definitely the prenatal fitness side, because it's so impactful long term. And then we also offer the postpartum as well. And then in 2020, we really kind of took off online with the education that we were providing. I was just decided I was going to start just posting educational videos about what I was learning and like, like experimenting with my clients and it, people just really resonated with it.
And so we do a lot of content online now. It's about like pelvic mechanics, like how to create space within your pelvis, different types of movements to do modifications to do, but like a really big emphasis on that birth preparation. Cause that's. Really what a lot of folks are focusing on during their pregnancies as well.
So that's kind of how we kind of came to where we are now.
KAREN: Wow. That's a fascinating background. I love that you have military background. So you're obviously fit, you know, the importance of, of staying active, but then seeing the lack of resources in our culture and our society for moms for fitness in this area.
And I love that sounds like you saw the void and decided, Hey, I'm going to start teaching and fill this. I'm going to start providing these resources that didn't exist, or were just starting to become, you know, come up. And yeah, you're right. It's been such a huge explosion of, I feel like resources and the availability of resources, birth stories, good information that women can have, but sometimes you have to go out.
and search for it. You don't always know, like, where do I find the, the prenatal fitness program that's for designed for pregnancy, not just like making modifications, like you said, to a normal workout routine. So how can a pregnant woman use fitness to prepare for her birth mentally and physically?
GINA: So for the mental aspect, this is something that I think is like usually when it comes to using fitness to help support is when we are approaching our workouts during We're going to have to modify at certain points, like certain movements are not going to be comfortable within our body.
They may just like, they may not feel accessible anymore. And so we're going to have to kind of tailor our workouts based on modifications that we need. And mentally that can be really hard for the ego. So if you are from an athletic background, you kind of identify as an athlete or you have like, I'm going to go to the gym and I'm going to do this specific workout, this many reps, this type of movements.
And then you get there and you're like, Oh, I actually don't feel very good today. Like my first trimester is really rough and I'm really nauseous and I don't feel like I'm really fatigued. I need to decrease my workout or I need to change the exercise that I'm doing. Like mentally that can be really challenging to do, but I find to be a really good way of like letting go of our expectations as we are mentally preparing for birth as well, because.
We don't know exactly how our labors are going to go and we should absolutely still prepare for birth and have plans and like set up our support teams, but we don't know exactly how our contractions are going to feel for us or how exactly the labor is going to unfold, how long it's going to be, how short it's going to be.
And so we have to be kind of open to the experience and like surrendering to the process. And I think when you can mentally do that with Workouts during your pregnancy where you're like, okay, I had this expectation that I was going to go and do this barbell back squat for this much weight for this many reps.
And then I was going to pair it with these movements. And then you get there and you're like, I actually don't feel very good today, or I don't, this movement isn't feeling great for me. I need to modify, or I need to do lighter weight, or I need to change the workout. Like. Yeah. Being able to kind of surrender to what your body needs is so impactful and it can really positively impact somebody's labor.
I usually see more issues with folks that. Are unwilling to like yield to what their body needs during pregnancy, because I have to keep doing my CrossFit workouts exactly the same way that I did before. I have to keep running exactly the same way that I did before. And then they get confused when they make it to labor, when they don't have that ability to kind of surrender to the ego and let kind of things unfold as they need when it comes to physically preparing for birth, like.
There, it is a physical process. Labor is a physically intensive process. And now there's a lot that we can do to make it more relaxing and a little bit easier, but we still have to be in good physical conditioning going into our labor, because one of the things that really helps to support labor progress is being in an upright position and moving because that's applying more pressure onto the cervix, helping with our labor hormone feedback loop.
And that is going to help make our labors go a little bit smoother. I usually see more issues with my clients that are a little bit more like sedentary during their labors where they're like really fatigued very early because they don't have that physical conditioning. And then the labors just take a little bit longer.
Like they still will progress through their labor. It just takes a little bit longer. And so when we're thinking about. Exercising during our pregnancy to help physically support our birth. We want to ensure that we're incorporating like strength endurance type exercises to build our stamina and our endurance.
So we want to be strong because we're, we're gaining more weight during pregnancy. We need to be able to move like increased mass over a prolonged period of time, because that's how we stay pain free, but we also want to have the stamina to maintain that upright position and to move for prolonged periods of time.
And so we're going to have higher reps. Higher volume with our workouts, but we also want to ensure that we have good hip mobility as well. So it's not just squats, all these excellent rotated movements. We also want to be thinking about, can I find asymmetrical movements? Can I find hip shifts? Can I find more internal hip rotation to help create that different types of space within the pelvis?
Because each pelvic level opens with different types of movement patterns. And then it's not just the pelvis. We also need to be thinking about what is my rib cage positioning because our rib cage impacts how we can move our pelvis and what position we can put our pelvis into. And so then it becomes a little bit more complex where it's not just, let me do all my deep squats and butterfly poses.
They're like, if anyone has ever been recommended to do like kegels, like it's not those movements only when it comes to birth preparation, we need to be thinking about, okay, I can do my external hip rotation. Can I also do asymmetrical? So not just wide leg positions, but also Positions where the legs are in different positions.
And then can I also find that internal hip rotation? But then also what is my rib cage position? How's my spinal mobility? How's my mobility overall? And so then you can kind of see how it becomes like a lot of different things that need to be incorporated. As we were preparing for birth physically, but to make it simple for somebody that's like, I just want to create my own thing is you need to have the strength endurance aspect.
So the cardio element doing higher volume, higher reps with your workouts, like trying to work out for at least like 30 to 45 minutes at a time, obviously like everyone's schedules 20 minutes, that's okay too, but more frequent throughout the week. And then we want to ensure that we're incorporating different exercises that are helping us move our pelvis and our hips in different ways with both legs being wide, both legs kind of being in different positions and then both legs being more internally rotated while also thinking about pelvic, like spinal mobility as well.
So that would kind of be like my blueprint or how I could prepare.
KAREN: That is a great summary. So I'm curious, you mentioned Kegels. Are, do you recommend them? Are they a go or a no?
GINA: So it depends. So a Kegel is a pelvic floor activation. I don't want to just say blanket statement like no one should ever Kegel because we do want to be able to activate our pelvic floor, but we want to be able to move our pelvic floor through its full range of motion.
So if we think about like my bicep, if I. I'm only kind of like doing this small little range of motion where I'm just bringing my fist to my shoulder repeatedly. The moment that I had to lengthen my arm one, it could actually be very difficult to lengthen my arm. Like I might actually kind of struggle to find that link.
If anyone's like ever like slept in a weird position or had like a cast on, like they broke their arm and then they go to straighten the arm. Like that's really challenging to do. Cause the arm's kind of been stuck in that shortened state. Okay. And it's the same thing for our pelvic floor. If I'm only focusing on the tight, tight, tight of my pelvic floor, the moment that I had to lengthen and stretch it, I would probably have a really hard time doing that.
And I would also probably just have a hard time relaxing my public floor in general. And that's where we're going to see more of those issues for folks that are like very active and then. Cause there are some misconceptions of if you exercise during your pregnancy, you're going to have a really tight pelvic floor and it's going to impact your birth negatively.
But one of the reasons that it could impact it is if you're only focusing on the Titan portion of the pelvic floor. And this can apply to somebody who's sedentary as well. Like we're always told like, Oh, do 500 key goals while you're driving or at every stop, like do 10 key goals. But it's the same thing.
We're only focusing on the tightening portion. We want to be able to lengthen and stretch our pelvic floor. Relax it and then also tighten it. And we can do that with our breathing. So instead of thinking, I'm going to do my thousand kegels a day, we want to think about, I'm going to inhale to fill my pelvic floor, move down and stretch.
I'm going to exhale to shorten my pelvic floor. So it's this inhale to lengthen, exhale to shorten, or it can be inhaled to lengthen, exhale to relax. And so that's another kind of confusion point where. It's not inhale to relax, exhale to shorten it's inhaled to lengthen to a state of tension and then exhale to relax.
And so if you think about like, when you take a big sigh, we take this really big inhale, which is like a stretching point, and then we exhale to let go to that relaxed state. And so that's, that's usually how I'll explain like the difference between inhales being stretching, exhales being relaxed. And so it's not that we don't want any pellet for activation because we absolutely do need the pellet for to be able to tighten and to shorten, but we also equally need it to be able to lengthen and stretch.
And we can do that with our breathing. And then thinking about what type of hip movements that we're incorporating into like our mobility routines as well, because it's not just. Wide knees, butterfly pose, deep squats, because the pelvic floor attaches to the pelvis and different types of movements bring different types of tension within the pelvic floor.
So similar to how there's no one movement that opens the entire pelvis for labor, there's also not one movement that stretches the entire pelvic floor. And so when we have more of those excellent rotated positions or open hip wide knee positions, we're actually stretching more of the front half of the pelvic floor.
But the back half is shortening and tightening. And so this is why it's also important to incorporate more of that intralateral rotated positions or like knees in ankles out. If you've scrolled Instagram long enough, you've probably seen somebody in all fours where their ankles out and their knees are staying closer, hip shifted movements are also going to be really helpful.
So those are going to. Target more of the back half of the pelvic floor, which during pregnancy, a lot of us tend to have a little bit more tension because of common postural tendencies that we have. And so we have like a whole free birth prep circuit that I'll send you the link for, it's free to share.
In the circuit, we go over a bunch of exercises that target like common areas of tension during pregnancy because a lot of us tend to favor very similar things. There's common trends. And so when we can target like releasing the lats, releasing the hip flexors, releasing the back half of the pelvic floor, we tend to find that people stay more comfortable throughout their pregnancy.
And their labor is a little bit easier because they can create the space that they need because they don't have that imbalance within their pelvic floor within their bodies. So
KAREN: yeah, that is amazing. That is a brilliant answer to a question and it, and it really is kind of like a Pandora's box. It opens up this whole concept of biomechanics.
And for some of you listening, you may be thinking, Oh my gosh, this is way over my head. Or. I've never even thought about this. I've just been doing some minimal exercise or maybe you're an athlete and you work out regularly. I think every pregnant woman needs to pay attention to this and knowing that there's so many nuances within the pelvic floor.
And like you mentioned, If your pelvic floor is able to yield, it's not just about being strong and tight. And we have this, I feel like this is also like a misnomer, even in the childbirth education world, there's so much strength about being strong. Like women are strong for labor and it's like, and we have to strengthen our muscles and you heard all this talk about Kegels, you know, and the, Years ago and and now it's not so much about strength.
It's about yielding It's about does your pelvic floor have the mobility the range of motion the space available for you to have a pain free Pregnancy and for baby to fit and come and descend that Movement that ability to actually shift and change and stretch and open and go through all those segments that labor requires is actually far more important and you know this as a doula having probably seen women where babies were in funky positions and how much that can impact a labor and stall a labor or create more pain or create a long, elongated labor.
And so these, these sometimes subtle differences and the, whether that's the flexion, the tone, the mobility of your pelvic floor muscles can really impact birth. And I love that you're going into the biomechanics because I love to geek out on this and I'm learning and taking notes because it's just so beautiful.
And if, If moms are like a little like, oh my gosh, I didn't know all of this, check out her programs because I don't remember having programs like this, but sometimes I think just staying fit and active and moving in different ways, not just doing like you said, one exercise is so important and key.
And if the, and, And taking a program that's actually designed for pregnancy so that it is targeting all those different kinds of emotions within the hips and within your spine and within the pelvic floor. I think that is just so beautiful. What, tell us a little bit about weightlifting. Does that increase the risk of a tight pelvic floor and how can women mitigate this risk?
GINA: So that is usually a big concern. And I see that a lot with like birth doulas and like birth professionals where they're like really concerned that their client is doing CrossFit or they're lifting weights, like their pelvic floor is going to be so tight. And it's similar to the other things that I've been talking about.
If you do one type of movement pattern all the time, it's not. It's going to reinforce certain types of muscular balance within your body. And so commonly with like a standard weightlifting program and a standard CrossFit like program, everything is very much in the sagittal plane, which is that front to back plane and movement plane.
And there's three different movement planes. We also need to be able to move in the frontal plane, which is like a side to side movement. And then also the transverse plane. So like rotation within our body. And so if your entire workout program is squats, deadlifts, snatches, cleans, everything in this front to back, everything's, yes, it's going to reinforce certain movement patterns, which is going to reinforce certain types of balance within our body.
And commonly what we'll see is. Is we have tighter back half of our pelvic floor. So the sacrum has a hard time moving and changing positions. We're kind of stuck in this extended position and we have more external hip rotation. And the reason is it's a power position. Like if we, if you think about what like the top of a lift looks like, it's a lot of extension and external rotation.
Cause that's how we're generating our power and those aren't bad positions, but those that's also the position that we favor during pregnancy. So that's a. Postural position that we like, we like to be a little bit more kind of belly leading the way, cause it's more comfortable, it's easier to kind of collapse into that position.
And so now we have this twofold problem where our workout program is really reinforcing this very specific movement pattern. And then our, the rest of the day, we're also kind of stuck in this position. This is going to really impact your ability to release tension within your pelvic floor and the two also to create space within the bottom half of your pelvis.
Like the inlet is wide open with this position. The outlet is going to be very close. The bottom half of the pelvis, the lower half of the pelvis is going to be a little bit more restricted. And so we're going to see more of those late labor stalls or potentially like really long pushing phases, or just maybe not being able to navigate through, cause they're in a kind of a funky position.
And so what can we do to mitigate that? Cause if anyone is listening and they do CrossFit or they lift, they're like, okay, well, I should just stop. Which is sometimes what people think they need to do when we are looking at your workout program. We also need to make sure that we're incorporating the other planes of motion.
So it's not just squats, deadlifts, clean snatches. We're also doing movements that we're moving side to side. The legs are moving out and coming back together. We're doing. Tational movement, especially like single leg movements are some of my favorite ways to incorporate hip rotation. So when I come down to the lunge, I'm rotating my belly to my thigh to find more internal hip rotation.
And when I come up, I find more of an open hip position. So we're finding a closed hip open hip. So finding that rotation within the hip and then incorporating a lot of that mobility work as well. So we can. Move our muscles through these like different movements with strength training, but we also need to incorporate that mobility aspect as well.
So we're finding bilateral hip external rotation. So both legs are wide. We're finding those asymmetrical positions, or I'm finding that rotation within my hip from internal to external. And then we're finding that bilateral internal rotation as well. So both legs are kind of coming more inwards. And so that's, what's really going to help somebody who is.
Doing that weightlifting program or doing that CrossFit program to be able to create space within their pelvis, to have that release of tension within the pelvic floor. But it's going to require them to kind of let go of what the standard weightlifting program looks like for a lot of folks is the squats and deadlifts.
Everything's front to back, everything's bilateral. And this is where like a program like mine is going to be super helpful. Like it's a challenging program. We incorporate barbells, we incorporate weights. If you're like, I want to keep lifting weights during my pregnancy, Well, hey, I got, I got a program for you.
That's going to help you do that and offer you modifications and incorporate the different planes to motion. If you're like really committed to your workout program, we have just a birth prep standalone program too, that incorporates all these different movements as well, but it's not touching weights equals tight pelvic floor.
It's when we are moving in a way that's. Only focusing on this one movement pattern that we're going to see issues. And this will apply to somebody who's lifting weights, somebody who doesn't exercise, if we're always stuck in the same position, it's going to impact the balance of our pelvic floor, the balance of the musculature, supporting our BB, how well we can create space within our pelvis.
And that's where our prenatal fitness programs can be really beneficial. And it doesn't have to be an hour long workout. It's just incorporating more movement throughout your day. Okay. Incorporating that mobility throughout our day. And they can be like, go for a 15 minute walk and then do like 10 minutes of mobility or things like that.
It doesn't have to be super crazy.
KAREN: Yeah, that makes so much sense. Because it's like everything is very linear with workouts traditionally, like, like you said, and I find this nonlinear movement that I've been looking into a lot more lately, like, which is really essentially like getting movement and activating the spine to move in different ways rather than just front and back side to side, which is even that sometimes we have to incorporate the side to side.
But I'm just thinking of the spiritual implications, too, of what you're saying, because everything that's very linear. is more masculine in its energy. Whereas feminine energy, which is what we see in labor, traditionally women going into their feminine, into their bodies, going, you know, into that deep labor land space, they're disconnecting from this very kind of rigid, masculine, linear, Culture and and they start in when they're being intuitive, they're moving their hips, they're swaying, and you see that in traditional cultures of women who may be pregnant and preparing for birth, they may be working in the field, they may be, you know, more accustomed to dancing or squatting or sitting on the floor.
And there's much more movement, nonlinear movement also incorporated into pregnancy. And we see that in labor and delivery. When women are allowed to go into that intuitive state of mind. And so I think, of course, we want to incorporate that into our pregnancies as well, and not just be stuck in one sort of linear masculine routine.
And maybe that's what People are used to, but I think it's just awesome to take note and reference of like, what are the movements that we do over and over again in our day? Like for me, I'm sitting all the time for someone else. They may be used to one type of workout or just walking and incorporating the full range of motion and energy.
And, you know, maybe challenging yourself to do more of those hip flexors or more of that open, open hips or. Knees in feet out kind of things is just a really amazing way to look at it and to think how how easy it is to get stuck in our own habits. Sometimes like this is what I used to. This is what I do.
And then we go, Oh, my gosh, there's this whole other world out here. That's going to really help me prepare for labor and delivery in a more full spectrum way. So thank you for sharing that. How can How can women use movement during birth to support labor progress?
GINA: So this was something that I noticed when I was a doula and no one else had really like told me about it before, but I have noticed like other birth professionals kind of noting it is we tend to intuitively move in a way that's creating space for wherever our baby needs.
And so when baby's still trying to enter or engage into the pelvis, all of my clients tend to favor this like front to back, kind of like tucking their butt underneath movement pattern. Because they're trying to create space in the pelvic inlet to help baby enter or engage. And then after baby has engaged, everything becomes very side to side and sway.
They're shifting their weight from leg to leg as baby is kind of rotating through. And then when they are, baby is like really low, they start kind of favoring, like shifting into one hip over and over again. Like they're coming up. On their tippy toes and kind of really pushing their weight towards one side or they're favoring this kind of like little mini quarter squat type movement where the knees are kind of coming in.
And so I think the power of intuition is really powerful when it comes to labor, but we have to make sure that those movement patterns are accessible to us during pregnancy so that they can be accessible to us during labor as well. Because if I cannot create that space within the bottom half of my pelvis, because I cannot shift into my hip.
It's going to make it really hard for my baby to kind of navigate and get underneath the pubic bone. And so again, this is where that prenatal fitness becomes really beneficial. And so movements that help to create space in the top of the pelvis is going to be pelvic tilting from front to back. In addition to more external hip rotation with abduction.
So legs kind of moving outward. So thinking like those deep squats, butterfly poses, movements like that with just like that pelvic tilting. So that anterior pelvic tilt, where we're kind of arching in our back a little bit more, is creating a little bit more space to the front half of our pelvis or the pelvic inlet.
And then when we're tucking our butt underneath, it's moving the sacrum backwards. We have this kind of junction between our lumbar spine and our sacrum. So the lower back and that triangular bone in the back of our pelvis that pushes inwards when we kind of round in our back and tuck our butt underneath that push that moves backwards.
And so we create more space kind of in the back half of the inlet. And so that's why we kind of favor this like alternating front to back type movement. We're trying to help baby engage during pregnancy that posterior pelvic tilt or tucking the butt underneath is more challenging to find because we like to live in that extended spine position.
It's more comfortable. Let belly lead the way. And so during pregnancy, we want to focus on. Can I find a more rounded position, which gets harder because now we have a baby that's in the way too. And so we want to be focusing on releasing tension within our lats, releasing tension within our hip flexors, strengthening our core, like our abdominal wall.
So it can pull the rib cage and pelvis closer to find that rounded position. We want to think about. Strengthen our hamstrings to kind of pull the pelvis from the bottom to find that tuck position. And doing that stuff is going to help us be able to find that rounded position to help baby engage. And so if we're having issues with baby entering into the pelvis, it's probably due to not being able to find a perfect position.
Posterior pelvic tilt. And so during labor, what I would be doing is we would be doing lot releases. We would do a hip flexor release either like where I'm doing it for my client, or like I put them into a position that if, depending on if they have an epidural or not, and then we're focusing on like, okay, when we're in our laboring position, we're trying to find these more rounded positions and like kind of release that tension there.
But ideally we're not waiting till labor to figure out how to find this movement. As baby begins to navigate through the mid pelvis, this is where they're rotating. And so we have all of those asymmetrical movements kind of happening. So shifting our weight from side to side, swaying hip circles, like, and like you were saying before, all that, like sideways, like nonlinear type movement is starting to happen now as baby's kind of wiggling and rocking through.
Usually where we see issues with the mid pelvis is going to be the lower mid pelvis. And so the upper mid pelvis, there's like two like mini levels to the mid pelvis. The upper mid pelvis is going to open more with like one sided open hip positions. So think about like that really big elevated lunge with a leg really out.
Like knee away from chest that's opening the upper mid pelvis to help baby begin to rotate While the lower mid pelvis is going to be open more with closed hip positions on one side So this is where like that hip shift is going to happen And so if i'm seated and I think drive one hip crease back as I drive the opposite knee forward That's a hip shift.
So the legs aren't necessarily moving out or in but we're kind of like Changing the orientation of the pelvis to the femur bone if that makes more sense and we have a lot of videos on our Instagram and our YouTube for if anyone's listening and they're like, I have no idea what she's talking about.
I find visual demonstrations to be much easier.
KAREN: Me too. I'm a visual girly. Yeah.
GINA: And so when it comes to the lower mid pelvis, it's those hip shifts that are really going to help create that space to help baby get underneath that pubic bone. It helps to release tension in the posterior pelvic floor. It allows the sacrum to move a little bit more.
And so That is going to be really important to be able to find during pregnancy and usually kind of something that is going to impact someone's birth like pretty significantly. This is like somebody who's at eight centimeters and like quote unquote stuck. You've been pushing for like three or four hours and baby is just stuck.
Rocking and rocking and rocking underneath that pubic bone. So usually what I find is if somebody is like stuck at like that eight, like a late labor stall, they've been here for hours. Like once we start doing more like directed hip shifting movements, it really just creates that space for baby to kind of finish that rotation.
And all of a sudden the baby's being born or they've been pushing for a long time and baby's rocking and rocking. Like they're kind of doing that little rotation, but not quite finishing. We just kind of shift one hip back a little bit. And all of a sudden the baby just gets underneath the pubic bone.
What positions
KAREN: would that look like?
GINA: So usually it's like a, like a half lunge position or where the leg is more forward as opposed to out, or I even just like to use a yoga block or like a, like a folded up pillow and I'll put it underneath. One knee. And that's going to help kind of change the orientation to the pelvis.
If they're sidelined, I'll press on one knee to drive it, that hip back to bring it into that hip shift. And that can help create the space as well. So again, these, I have all these pictures and stuff, cause that's sometimes it's hard to know. It
KAREN: is fascinating if you guys are following along, because I know it's a lot of technical terms, but even for doulas, I feel like this is going to be so helpful for doulas to learn how to support women in these different stages of labor, because depending on where you're at in labor, it will require different techniques to help reposition baby if there is a biomechanical issue like that, and baby's stuck, or labor is stalled, and This is not uncommon, like the things we're talking about here happen very often in labor, like labor's going along great, and then I hear women will tell me their story and like, Oh, I got stuck at eight centimeters forever, or I was pushing for four hours and baby just kind of wouldn't come out, wouldn't, It was stuck and, and of course the doctors don't know what to do, but like we go to the hospital and we think, Oh, the OBs are the experts.
They'll help us. They'll, you know, everything will work, but OBs aren't trained in this at all. They have zero knowledge of biomechanics and how to rotate babies. Then we're starting to see some programs enter hospitals. And it's encouraging. But this is the kind of information and knowledge you really do have to learn yourself.
You really, as, as pregnant women, as doulas, we need to, to understand how these, the physiology works, how the anatomy works, where the baby's at, what is needed. And sometimes I find a lot of this happens intuitively. Like mom just kind of knows if she's not medicated and she's in tune with her body, she'll often do a lot of these positions.
Sometimes it doesn't always come intuitively. And that one shift, that one position, that one technique can release. And baby shifts and rotates and then births easily. So, I so believe in the power of what you're talking about. And for those of you who are thinking, Oh my gosh, this is a little bit overwhelming.
Go to her Instagram, Mama Stay Fit, go watch the videos, take the prenatal classes, get the movement, get the language in your body. And then when you're in labor, it won't feel like you're learning a second language. It won't feel, Like, like it's outside of your, your repertoire because you will have already seen it or done it and physically done it kinesthetically is the best, right?
So I just, I love what you're sharing. There's so many gold nuggets in this. Tell us about what's a good daily exercise routine for women to help prepare for birth? And that's along with this question, when women are pregnant and their doctors are telling them, oh, you can't exercise, you got to stop exercising and you have to be, you know, Like I hear there's like this, how do I say it?
It's, it's like this, we project onto women, like, okay, you're delicate and weak now and you can't do anything hard. You can't do any strong workouts. You can't lift weights. You're going to stop your exercise routine. I'm sure you've heard this a lot. What do you say to that? First of all, just that like belief that like pregnant women shouldn't be working out.
GINA: So there's, there's definitely a lot of fear involved with exercising during pregnancy. And a lot of it's like outdated, like. Things that have not based on actual research, which is really frustrating, but just kind of like these old concepts of if you lift weights, your placenta will detach. If you move too much, you'll go into preterm labor.
You'll have a miscarriage. Like, so there's just like a lot of fear involved with exercising. And so then the, What the result is, is, well, we better be safe than sorry. Like just don't exercise and then everything will be fine. But there is a lot of benefit to exercising during pregnancy. And so when we tell someone to not exercise, to be safe, we're, we're telling them to ignore all the benefits of moving during your pregnancy.
One, you can be comfortable. You don't have to be like, you don't have to be in pain during your pregnancy. Yes.
KAREN: Thank you for saying that.
GINA: The low back pain, the pelvic girdle pain, like the hip pain. The aches and pains.
KAREN: Everybody talks about, and, and they say like, it's totally normal if you're in pain, and you go to your doctor, and I know some of you listening have experiences, you're like, oh, well, I have this aching, these aches, and these pains, and I'm swollen, and this and that, and what's everyone's response?
Oh, that's normal, you're pregnant. When you give birth, it'll go
GINA: away. Yeah. When you give
KAREN: birth, it'll go away. Drives me crazy. No, that is your body saying, ow, I need help. Something's off.
GINA: And movement is so beneficial that we make it help with swelling because some of it relates to our lymph system. And the way that we move our lymph like fluid around is with movement, with exercising, just walking.
And so it is very frustrating when people are told just It's better to be safe than sorry, because you'll have a more painful pregnancy when you don't need to just with regular movement, because the reason why we get in pain is because we're stuck in positions. And once we kind of just start shifting our position, we tend to find a lot of pain relief.
The other thing that's really beneficial is one, like it's going to make labor a little bit easier for you because you're going to have the stamina to be upright. There's so many impacts postpartum as well, because now you're going into postpartum. Any better, like physical condition. And so you're going to heal a little bit easier.
Like, I'm not saying like, if you exercise, you'll have an easy postpartum by any means, but if you were deconditioned for nine months, and then you have this like planned trauma of birth, and then you have your one to two months that you took off after birth to recover. And now you're trying to get back.
We're already so far behind, like, so there's just, it's, it's, it's. Exercise and doing your pregnancy is so impactful for this long term health. It's also really beneficial for your baby. Like there's so many benefits for baby improved cognitive function, improved nervous system development, brain development, like increased blood volume, they're more resilient to the stresses of labor and to postpartum.
And so. There isn't any research that supports exercising is dangerous. Now, of course, if you have a specific complication, usually like a pre existing medical condition, you have placenta previa, your water is broken, you have severe preeclampsia, like, yes, of course, like those would not be times to exercise.
But for the majority of people as a low risk pregnancy, exercising is perfectly safe. Now I wouldn't like go skydiving or like, Throw my body against the floor or anything, but like you should probably not like a hit
KAREN: workout. Right? Yeah.
GINA: Maybe not a kickboxing class. Like, let's maybe not do that. And so what I would say, like, if somebody was like, okay, I haven't been exercising at all.
What should I even do? Because A lot of us are, don't exercise. Like it's not like a standard part of them, of like an American daily routine. Go for some walks. Like, even if it's like a 20 minute walk, if it's hot AF where you are, get like, like it is for us here in North Carolina, like get like a walking treadmill for Inside, like you can usually find some of those really inexpensive ones for your desk, get like a birth ball instead of a chair for your desk.
Cause you can just move around. That'll really help with low back pain. But that's usually like my easiest or stretching.
KAREN: Like I remember I wasn't big in your body. I wasn't big into working out when I was pregnant with my first and I would, but by the end of the pregnancy, I, my body is like, if you don't move your hips, like you're in pain right away.
And so I started doing like a 20 minute, Spinning babies, yoga, kind of stretching video. And that alone just like made a world of difference, just even stretching and doing the, these movements like Gina's talking about get some movement in, like whether it's walking, exercise, ball, stretching. It's going to help you so much and if you can do more like with with her workouts, I think you'll, you'll see the benefits so much.
And I just need to say this too. I feel like you, we talked about this like mentality of like, Oh, women can't work out when they're pregnant. There's also this mentality, like as soon as we get pregnant, now we're eating for two. So not only do we like stop working out, but we start eating twice as much because we think we have to, or that's just like the standard American mindset.
And we don't just eat double we eat like worse food because it's this mentality like, well you're supposed to be hungry all the time so you're, you have to kind of be, you know, ravenous and starving and we, I see women all the time who do amazing on their diets and then they get pregnant and they like, Go off a cliff because it's like the excuse of, well, I'm eating for two and all of a sudden they're eating fast food and they're gaining all this weight, and of course they're not feeling good, but they blame it on their pregnancy.
Like, Oh, I just feel so tired. I feel so achy. It's my pregnancy. So awful. They're like, well, of course it is. You're eating junk. Like if anything, your pregnancy is like the time in your life where you should be. Eating the most nutritious food and taking the best care of your body because it's not just gonna benefit you It's gonna benefit your baby.
Like it's seeding that baby's microbiome. So I know that's a bit off topic I just had to go on a rant because I feel like pregnancy gives women this excuse and doctors reinforce it like oh No, don't don't work out. You have to you know, it's it's dangerous and you're eating for two So here's a Big Mac like I'm like what?
What, where did we get this idea that like, it didn't matter. Like we just stop taking care of our physical health in pregnancy.
GINA: There's definitely a lot of misconceptions on the safety, but anyone that's listening, like there is a lot of research that supports exercising during pregnancy, lifting weights during pregnancy is perfectly safe.
It doesn't increase your risk of miscarriage. It's not going to make your baby too small. preterm labor, which are usually the biggest concerns. And there's numerous, numerous benefits. And so my book training for two comes out in September and there's like an entire chapter dedicated to the myths of pregnancy, like fitness and the benefits for both you and for your baby, because there are a lot of benefits of you.
And it doesn't have to be super complex. Like you could just go for walks. There's so many things on YouTube. Like we release like weekly YouTube workouts that somebody could follow. You can do the same workout every week. It would be totally fine. If you're not familiar with exercising, like we have on demand videos, which is like a workout video that you follow and work out with at the same time.
That's made for pregnancy. If you're more of an athlete and you're like, you know what. I think I need to do something specific to exercising during my pregnancy to support my pregnancy and to prepare for my birth, but I still want to be challenged with the program. We have an app based program. That's our prenatal strength program.
That one's made for athletes. Like I came from a really athletic background. I used to be in the army, like I'm still like in fairly good shape. And so I wanted to make a program that was challenging for me. And so we have a lot of different offerings based on your fitness level, like What you're looking for with your workout.
So you don't have to reinvent the wheel. You don't have to try to research it all and figure it out. Like we have resources for you to help you kind of move through this journey more confidently. And that's like our biggest goal here at mama's stay fit is we want people to feel confident moving their bodies during their pregnancy, making decisions for themselves throughout their pregnancy, like really kind of intuitively, like listening to what their body is communicating to them with their workouts.
And that translates really well to labor work. You're moving easier or baby's navigating through your pelvis easier. You're feeling more confident, like listening to your body is like signs and what it's telling you. And then that carries into postpartum because you've been confident this whole journey, and now you've entered motherhood and you're like, I've been listening to myself and to my gut this whole time.
I feel confident making decisions for me and my baby, as opposed to this is dangerous. I need to like be afraid of pregnancy. Pregnancy is painful and like awful.
KAREN: Yeah.
GINA: Which I mean, for some, yes, like it can, it cannot, not everyone's going to have like this beautiful pregnancy experience. But like when we're when we expect someone to like hold our hand through the whole process, instead of like finding like the power within ourselves, it just kind of makes it a little bit harder in the postpartum to to like, remember that like, we have a lot of power within us that like, You get what I'm saying?
I totally,
KAREN: 100 percent Gina, you are speaking my language. Girl, I love it because I am all about this like, let's disempower this belief that like, pregnancy is all about suffering. And I have a whole module in my eCourse called like, Pain Free Pregnancy. And I challenge women, stop complaining about your pregnancy because you're basically setting yourself up for misery and pain.
And a lot of that is not just taking care of your body and doing, making healthy choices to stay active and fit and eat healthy, but also we literally just expect women to suffer. And we take this mentality that like, Pregnancy and labor and delivery is this thing we have to suffer through, and if we could get out of this victim mode and realize that yes, you may have aches and pains, yes, you may have medical issues, but guess what, like, your body is brilliant, and if you have the resources, sometimes those resources come into your life for a reason, if you have the sight to say, oh, this doesn't have to be my normal, but we have so normalized pain and suffering in pregnancy and labor, and we don't have to, and so I fully agree with you, like, yes, women have medical conditions, yes, there's exceptions to the rule, but overall, for most women, if we're intuitive and following our body's lead, and taking care of our body, nutritionally, physically, mentally, and emotionally, We don't have to suffer through it.
And I felt great until I gave birth at 41 weeks, I did not feel pregnant and I encourage women, like you don't have to suffer. You can feel great up until the very end, but we get, it's like we get into this like mindset and, and I don't know where the line is, it might be different for different people, but it's like once you cross that line, oh, it's miserable, I'm suffering, I just have to get rid of these babies, and it's like, but why?
I, I just love asking the questions and challenging women, and I love that you're creating the resources for women to challenge that suffering victim mindset. And this may be triggering for some people, because you may be really comfy in your Like passive state of you know what I like I'm attached to my suffering and maybe this will challenge you a little bit because here's, here we are sharing resources to say you don't have to stay there, and it's okay if you're there, like we have so much empathy for you, but we're also telling you, you can change it, you have the power within you to change your state to change your body to Give your body and your baby what it needs to get out of the suffering and out of the pain and start treating it with the love and nourishment and the movement that it needs.
And so I didn't have these resources when I was pregnant, Gina. I'm so excited listening to you share about all the programs you have for women of all different fitness levels, because honestly, the bottom line is like, there's no excuse. Ladies, like, It's time to take care of yourself.
Take care of your baby, set yourself up for success. And no matter where you're at in your fitness level, check out Gina's programs, because man, I would have been so excited to just know that something is created for me as a pregnant woman, that's going to target all the areas I need to within my pelvic floor, within my range of motion, whether I'm just starting to exercise or whether I'm at like a trained.
professional athlete. I love that you have resources for everybody. So tell us where women can find you and these resources.
GINA: So for our paid content, like the fitness programs and education courses that we offer mama, stay fit. com is our website. We have everything there. There's even like a little quiz that you can take to help you figure out what the best courses for you.
And like Karen was saying, like we have folks that have never worked out before join our programs. We have professional athletes that join our program. So it's a really big wide range. Because there's something for everyone based on how you like to exercise. You can also find us on Instagram and YouTube and we're on Tik TOK, but we're not like super active over there, but I would say Instagram and YouTube are our biggest platforms that we have.
It's just at mama, stay fit on both of them. On YouTube, we release weekly workouts. We have tons of educational content that we post over there relating to pregnancy, like fitness, birth, postpartum a lot of the content that I create, I also create with my sister, Roxanne, who's a labor nurse and student midwife.
So you kind of get the best of both worlds where this doula perinatal fitness trainer, kind of on the more like holistic, like movement side of like solving problems. Well, also kind of the medical side of understanding what these different interventions are and making them not scary. Cause again, we want people to feel confident as they move through their pregnancies, as they navigate different decisions, because we do have unique experiences.
Some of us will have complications. Some of us won't have complications, but it's still important to know what these different options are for us so that we feel empowered making decisions that may or may not. Relate to what we were planning for our births. So yeah, so we have a ton of free stuff on Instagram and YouTube.
We add our blog. We have a podcast as well. It's just called the mama say fit podcast. Everything's mama say fit just to make it super easy. And then my book trading for two comes out September 10th. So depending on when someone's listening to this, it may be available for pre order. It may be a bill.
Bowable now for overnight shipping from Amazon. Now I'm training for two is all about using prenatal fitness to support a strong pregnancy pain free because pain is not a requirement of pregnancy. And then also help you prepare for birth. And there's a whole chapter in there about early postpartum recovery as well.
The book has pictures, written descriptions, in addition to QR codes to videos. Cause I, again, I'm a very visual person. I like, that's how I learn best. And so it links to YouTube videos of like that show you how to do different movements as well, because sometimes just the photo is not enough. Cause there is a little bit of nuance to some of these movements to really help support like a comfortable pregnancy as well.
So. If you're local to us here in North Carolina, we're in Moore County by Pinehurst. You can come work out with us in person. We have tons of resources within our gym as well, but yeah, so that's how you can find us.
KAREN: Amazing. Definitely check this out, ladies, and get her book, especially if it's on pre order.
That always helps on Amazon with ranking. So go out and support Gina and what the work she's doing. Just incredible. Thank you for taking the time today to dive into this very deep and nuanced subject and make it accessible for so many women and to really truly empower women because I just, you know, It's true, like, we sometimes get comfortable in our excuses, and while there can be very legitimate reasons for why things are going on, we can also, I believe, improve our quality of life for us and our babies by doing sometimes very simple things, like working out for 20 minutes a day, or stretching, or moving.
And so, thank you for the work you're doing, for supporting mamas and families, and we just so appreciate you here on the Pain Free Birth Podcast.
GINA: Thank you for having me.
